Ten All-time Favorite Albums

Fellow SG blogger John Scheideman did his most recent post on the most significant albums in Southern Gospel history. In an email exchange afterwards, we touched on how nearly impossible “best” is to quantify. I’m not entirely certain how we got to this point, but we more or less dared one another to post a top 10 favorite Southern Gospel albums list in our respective blogs.

So, totally freeing myself from the pressure to make a “best-of” list that I can give quantifiable justification for, here are my personal favorites:

  1. Cathedral Quartet – Sings Albert E. Brumley Classics (1976)
  2. Cathedral Quartet – Easy on the Ears, Heavy on the Heart (1976)
  3. Cathedral Quartet – Plain Ole Gospel (1975)
  4. Cathedral Quartet – Radio Days (1996)
  5. Perrys – Look No Further (2007)
  6. Ernie Haase & Signature Sound – Stand By Me Live (2004)
  7. Cathedral Quartet – Reunion (1995)
  8. Cathedral Quartet – Statue of Liberty (1974)
  9. Perrys – This is the Day (2003)
  10. Kingsmen – Live at the University of Alabama (1983)

    My short list must have been at least 35 entries long. So I couldn’t stop at 10. Sorry, John, but here goes!

  11. Cathedral Quartet – Keep on Singing (1979)
  12. Cathedral Quartet – Something Special (1979)
  13. Kingdom Heirs – Going On with the Song (2003)
  14. Florida Boys – He Shall Return (1996)
  15. Perrys – Come Thirsty (2006)
  16. Greater Vision – Hymns of the Church (2006)
  17. Cathedrals – A Little Bit of Everything (1970)
  18. Florida Boys – Timeless (1987)
  19. Inspirations – Golden Street Parade (1975)
  20. Perrys – Hits & Hymns 1 (2001)

And, for whatever it’s worth, here are my “honorable mention” runners-up:

  • Blackwood Brothers – In Concert (1960)
  • Blue Ridge Quartet – By His Hand (1963)
  • Brian Free & Assurance – Live in New York City (2004)
  • Cathedral Quartet – You Ain’t Heard Nothing Yet (1979)
  • Cathedral Quartet – Live in Atlanta (1983)
  • Cathedral Quartet – Master Builder (1986)
  • Cathedral Quartet – Travelin’ Live (1986)
  • Cathedral Quartet – Symphony of Praise (1987)
  • Cathedral Quartet – Farewell Celebration (1999)
  • Gold City – Are You Ready (2000)
  • Greater Vision – Live at First Baptist Atlanta (2002)
  • Greater Vision – Quartets (2003)
  • Happy Goodmans – Portrait of Excitement (1968)
  • Hoppers – The Ride (2006)
  • Kingsmen – Big & Live (1973)
  • Kingsmen – Live Naturally (1981)
  • Kingsmen – When God Ran (2007)
  • Legacy Five – London (2003)
  • Liberty Quartet – Timeless Treasured Hymns 2 (2007)
  • Mark Trammell Trio – Once Upon a Cross (2007)
  • Palmetto State Quartet – Knock Knock Knock (2004)
  • Weatherfords – Finest in Gospel Singing (1959)

What are your top 10 (or 20) favorites?

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  1. My list, in no particular order (bear in mind that I’ve been listening to Southern Gospel for only five or so years, so I don’t have many of the older albums):

    Greater Vision – Quartets (2003)
    Mark Trammell Trio – Once Upon A Cross (2007)
    Legacy Five – London (2003)
    Legacy Five – A Little Taste of Heaven (?)
    Kingdom Heirs – Going On With the Song (2003)
    Perrys – Look No Further (2007)
    The Martins – An A Cappella Hymns Collection (1996)
    Gaither Gospel Series – Mountain Homecoming (1999)
    Mark Bishop – Everyday (2006)
    Gold City – Revival (2006)

    honorable mention
    Greater Vision – Everyday People (2007)

  2. Correction to one of your album dates: The Kingsmen’s “When God Ran” was 2008.

  3. since i’ve only been listening to SG for about 4 years now, my top ten is mostly newer stuff…so here goes…

    1. KPNR -Good To Be Free
    2. The Hoppers -Power
    3. Booth Brothers -The Blind Man Saw It All
    4. Gaither Vocal Band -I Do Believe
    5. KPNR -For The Glory
    6. The Hoppers -The Ride
    7. Gaither Vocal Band -Lovin’ Life (i know it’s new, but i can’t quit listening to it!)
    8. Gaither Vocal Band -Give It Away
    9. Sandi Patty -Was It A Morning Like This
    10. KPNR -Journey Of Joy (give it time, it will be in the top 5)

    my honorable mention:
    11. Gaither Vocal Band -Southern Classics
    12. The Perry’s -Life Of Love
    13. The Perry’s -Look No Further
    14. Gaither Vocal Band -Loving God, Loving Each Other
    15. Mark Lowry -I Love To Tell The Story
    16. The Collingsworth Family -We Still Believe
    17. Kingdom Heirs -True To The Call
    18. Sandi Patty -Glorious
    19. The Perry’s -This Is The Day
    20. The Hoppers -Great Day

  4. Aaron – sorry about that. You’re right.

    Tanner, welcome to the blog! Nice to see you here.

  5. thanks man! seriosuly, this is one of the better blogs in SG! keep up the good work!

  6. Thanks! I’ll try to do that!

  7. Here’s my list, Daniel (after #1 the places are fairly interchangable):

    1. Pillars Of Faith – Gold City
    2. Gospel’s Alive And Well – Imperials
    3. Performance – Oak Ridge Boys
    4. On Stage – Statesmen
    5. Voices In Praise, Acappella – Cathedrals
    6. Chattanooga Live – Kingsmen
    7. Live In New York City – Brian Free and Assurance
    8. Windows Of Home – Gold City
    9. Renewed – Gold City
    10. Black and White – Singing Americans

  8. Great list. Believe it or not, I haven’t yet been able to find copies of some of the albums on that list–the Gold City titles are hard to come by, and I haven’t found the Singing Americans album yet either.

  9. Pillars is indeed difficult to find…the double CD with Acappella Gold would be the best value, Acappella Gold is on my honorable mention list…I guess I’ll list those too….

    Blackwood Brothers – On Tour
    Blackwood Brothers – Give Us This Day
    BFA – Greater Still
    BFA – It’s So God
    BFA – Things That Last Forever
    Cathedrals – Something Special
    Cathedrals – Symphony Of Praise
    Cathedrals – High And Lifted Up
    Downings – This Is How It Is…Live
    Gold City – Acappella Gold
    Gold City – What A Great Lifestyle
    Imperials – New Dimensions
    Imperials – Live (1973)
    Imperials – One More Song For You
    Imperials – Now
    Imperials – Jake Hess and The Imperials
    Oak Ridge Boys – I Wouldn’t Take Nothing For My Journey Now
    Kingsmen – I Will
    Kingsmen – You’re Not Alone
    Kingsmen – Just A Little Closer Home
    Statesmen – Through The States
    Statesmen – Mystery Of His Way
    Statesmen – Peace O Lord

    • if anyone might be interested, i’ve just inherited a bunch of albums and found a copy of Imperials Live which happens to be autographed. I dont have room for all of these albums, so if anyone would like to buy it (offer whatever you think is fair), or if you know of someplace i can go that can get it to someone who would like it, please let me know at Orrosta@gmail.com I would really like to see this go to someone who could appreciate it rather than sending it to a thrift store or throwing it out. Thanks!

  10. Oops…forgot one…

    Prophets – Prophets (Sing 3002)

  11. Quick typo correction: “Something Special” was from 1982, not 1979. ’79 was before Mark Tramell and Kirk Talley’s days together in the Cathedrals.

  12. Oh, of course. I knew that, but must have gotten mixed up. Sorry about that!

  13. Daniel…

    Good list…and it’s OK that you went all the way to 35!:-)

    I’ll try to counter with my own list on my own blog.

    One challenge, though…maybe you could revisit this list in about a month, and see if the same albums would still be there!

    Oh, and do you want to borrow my copy of “Pillars”? It’s old. and been played(a lot!)…but if it would help…LOL!

  14. My picks (not in any paritcular order).
    Legacy 5: Strong In The Stregnth

    Legacy 5: London

    Kingsmen: Chatanooga Live

    Gold City: 24 K Gold.

    Gold City: Pilliars of Faith

    Mercy’s Mark Quartet: Mercy’s Mark

    Cathedrals: Albert E Brumley Classics
    Nothing beats a Stamps-Baxter type pianist and 4 of the best gospel singers there has ever been.

    Cathedrals: Travelling Live
    Danny Funderburk, Mark Tramell, Roger Bennett, Glen Payne, George Younce,
    “Homeland”, “Whosoever Will”, Bloodwashed Band”, “Boundless Love”…WOW. Words can’t express how good that concert was.

    Gaither Vocal Band: I Do Beleive

    Gold City: 20th Anniversary Live, volumes 1 and 2.

    Gold City: Campmeeting

    Isaacs: Pieces of Our Past
    Absolute pinnacle of their recording career.

    Isaacs: Carry Me

    Palmetto State Quartet: When He Blessed My Soul
    Palmetto State Quartet: There’s Something Going On
    Last 2 projects from that particular vocal lineup.

    Palmetto State Quartet: Knock, Knock, Knock

    The Martins: Live In His Presence
    I know I’m way over 10 on this list, but I hoestly don’t know if I could narrow it down.

  15. Daniel, I knew you knew that. That’s fine seeing that all humans are prone to temproarily forget things.

  16. Yes, indeed. And thanks for pointing it out for the benefit of any readers who might not have known.

    • Daniel please let’ me know how to email or message you If you’ve ever listened to Oh WhAt A Savior sung by Curtis Elkins you’d know why I’m still checking. I’m just not very “blog savvy “

      • Under the about menu, there’s a contact page. It looks like there were people looking at this particular page about three years ago who would have been happy to help. It has been so many years, though, that I doubt they are still checking back on this page to see if you replied.

      • Yes. However — I moved and life threw many challenges.
        I hope someone who knows of this song sung by Curtis Elkins ( on an album ) will respond. I have the you tube video but I want the album……. And I’ve heard it sung by many tenors but this one is the one that lifts me to the heavens in prayer……..

  17. Well my Top Ten Faves of Albums would be:

    These are from the past 10 years:
    1. Quartets-Greater Vision
    2. Changed Forever-Perrys
    3. Hope for Tomorrow-Talley Trio
    4. Journey of Joy-Karen Peck & New River
    5. Revival-Gold City
    6. Once upon a Cross-Mark Trammell Trio
    7. Greater Still-Brian Free & Assurance
    8. Driven-Crabb Family
    9. Lovin’ Life-Gaither Vocal Band
    10. Stages-Talley Trio

    Honorable Mentioned: Look No Further (Perrys), London (Legacy Five), The Call (Mike Bowling), Above It All (Martins), Live! At First Baptist Atlanta (Greater Vision)

    These are from the past 11 years and beyond:
    1. On the Road-Hinsons
    2. We Shall Behold the King-Nelons/Rex Nelon Singers
    3. Fire on Stage,Live!-Paynes
    4. Chattanooga Live!-Kingsmen
    5. Symphony of Praise-Cathedrals
    6. Leave Your Sorrows and Come Along-Happy Goodmans
    7. Pillars of Faith-Gold City
    8. Hinsongs-Hinsons
    9. Crossings-Perrys
    10. Wherever I Am-Talleys

    Honorable Mentioned: Prime (Hinsons), Good ‘n’ Happy (Happy Goodmans), Movin’ Up (Gold City), Live! in Atlanta (Cathedrals), Bubblin’ (Hinsons)

    Of course all of those may be changed within the next minute or so,but they are my top 10 faves.

  18. My top 10 albums would be:

    1.Ernie Haase and Signature Sound-Get Away Jordan
    2.Legacy Five-God’s Been Good
    3.Gold City-Pillars of Faith
    4.Legacy Five-Live in Music City
    5.Brian Free and Assurance-Real Faith
    6.Gaither Vocal Band-Lovin’ Life
    7.Cathedrals-High and Lifted Up
    8.Booth Brothers-Blind Man Saw It All
    9.Kingsmen-When God Ran
    10.Mercy’s Mark-Something’s Happening

    Honorable Mention:

    The rest of EHSS CDs, Rest of L5 CDs, Gold City Revival, and Gold City Are You Ready

  19. Here are the first ten albums that came to my mind…when the last track finishes on the following albums, I almost always think, “wow, I love that one!”

    Brian Free & Assurance:
    Live in Atlanta
    Things That Last Forever
    Real Faith

    The Whisnants:
    New Day Dawning

    Gold City:
    Movin’ Up
    Prepare the Way

    Legacy Five:

    Travelin Live
    Live in Atlanta

  20. This was nearly impossible for me. I tried to do my best in narrowing it down to my 10 favorites (as it stands right now). There are so many great albums missing. My original list consisted of over 50 recordings.

    1. Live…Naturally – Kingsmen
    2. Come Fly – McGruders
    3. From Out Of The West They Came, Live And On Stage – Hinsons
    4. The Ride – Hoppers
    5. Double Take Live In Charleston South Carolina – Gold City
    6. This Is The Day – Perrys
    7. This Is How It Is Live – Downings
    8. Have Arrived Live – Freemans
    9. Blind Man Saw It All – Booth Brothers
    10.Going On With The Song – Kingdom Heirs

    Honorable Mentions:
    1. A Beautiful Thing – CrossWay
    2. Touch Of Hinson, Glimpse Of Glory – Hinsons
    3. Pray – Crabb Family
    4. Chattanooga Live – Kingsmen
    5. Power – Hoppers
    6. 10th Anniversary Live – Greenes
    7. Get Ready – Nelons
    8. Ready To Leave – Hemphills
    9. Live At Murray State – JD Sumner & Stamps
    10.High Voltage – Hinsons
    11.Through The Fire – Ruppes
    12.Are You Ready – Gold City
    13.Live And Alive – Singing Americans
    14.What A Happy Time – Happy Goodmans
    15.Wherever You Are – Martins

  21. what great lists!!!! Where does one begin to make this kind of list. All of you have great lists.. I think my Top Ten(or 20) of my own collection (not taking away from any of these others, but i can only speak through what I’ve heard)
    1. Cathedrals- Campmeting Live
    2. The Crabb Family- Pray
    3. The Perrys- Hits and Hymns (Vol. 1- “Royal Descendant” will never be topped)
    4. The Whisnants- New Day Dawning
    5. Greater Vision- Live at First Baptist Atlanta
    6. Brian Free & Assurance- Real Faith
    7. Booth Brothers-Blind Man Saw it All
    8. Greater Vision-Far Beyond This Place
    9. The Whisnants- Promises
    10. The Perrys- Absolutely Positively Live

  22. i just can’t go without naming some albums missing from my list.. .
    Greater Vision- Now and Then Live
    Talley Trio- Testify
    KPNR- Four Days Late
    Gold City- Signed, Sealed, Delivered
    Legacy Five- A Little Christmas- couldn’t resist it.
    Kingdom Heirs- True to the Call
    Mike Bowling- Remembering the Hinsons
    Crabb Family- A Crabb Collection
    Issacs- Stand Still – AMAZING!!!
    Isaacs- Increase My Faith – I love their old sound they had back then- they still sound great now, but I would love for them to go back to the old bluegrass style for just one more album…
    Gatiher Vocal Band- Lovin’ Life- great CD
    Greater Vision- ALL THE CHURCH HYMNAL CD’S

  23. we should post a blog on our favorite SONGS… now that will be tough

  24. Good idea on the songs. I’ll do that on the next slow news day, next week if not before.

  25. anyone know which cd Curtis Elkins sings Oh What A Savoir?

    • Lynn, someone told me you had asked about Oh What A Savior. I can get that for you a year later. Let me know if you still check this blog.


      • Thank you for your response…. I am Mel Felder’s sister. I gave him my copy of the albumn and Lola gave to to someone else… Yes I will respond. I had given up.

      • Still seeking the Curtis Elkins Oh What a Savoie. Please respond

      • I have the album with Curtis Elkins singing O What A Savior. How do I get in touch with you outside this blog?

      • Wow. Replies spanning three years here!

      • I just checked Again. My email is texastullos@yahoo.com I am still trying to find Curtis Elkins singing Oh What A Savior. Please respond

      • Yes I still check.

  26. Matt,
    The Isaacs have always been good. Yet there was just something special, which I can’t really put into words, that chartetized the group and their music when Joe, Tim, and John were still there. I really miss the acoustic ballads that the group performed during that time, such as “She Cries”, “From The Depths Of My Heart”, “Honestly”, “Carry Me.” Their music on the projects from about 1993-2000 showed me that bluegrass doesn’t have to be exclusivley the “Bill Monroe” style, so I started liking bluegrass without even knowing it.
    Seaton, your list mentioned the Ruppes having a project called “Through the Fire”. Was that the Crabb song?
    Andrew S. , thanks for mentioning “The Call”. I somehow forgot about that. It was a benchmark project in Mike’s career with 2 Singing News number one songs. Both have a very clear, strong message that we all should take to heart. Amazing lyrics. There is not a weak song on there. “Greatfully”, the duet with Karen Peck, and “Grand Reunion In Heaven” are also amazing songs.

    I would add to the rest of the mentioned projects “A Crabb Collection” by the Crabb Family. This last, if I’m not mistaken, project with Gerald was one of their strongest.

  27. Got to add this as an honerable mention: Oh Happy Day by the Cathedral Quartet. I think Something Special was already mentioned, but if not, then it deserves amongst these lists also

  28. Quaid,
    I will DEFINITELY have to agree with you on the Isaacs… I loved Tim, and Jon, and Joe. Those were great songs you mentioned, too. It seems as though they sing songs that would only sound good in a bluegrass style. i wouldn’t expect to hear “From the Depths of my Heart” with a piano and a bass. It just wouldn’t fit to me.

    And the Ruppes song “Through the Fire” was a different song than the Crabb Family’s version. I used to think that too until I heard it.
    I need to add another album- the first Mike Bowling Group CD called “Graceland”. I don’t know how many of you bought it or have heard it, but if that doesnt’ remind you of a Hinsons/old Perrys sound, nothing will. I love that album… call me old- fashioned, but it will never die…

  29. This is hard but the ones that come to mind are (in no particular order):

    1. Gold City – Movin’ Up
    2. Gold City – Pillars of the Faith
    3. Cathedrals – Master Builder
    4. The Downings – This is How it is LIVE
    5. The Happy Goodmans – (any of their recordings)
    6. The Freemans – (any of their recordings)
    7. The Hinsons – (any of their recordings)
    8. Brian Free & Assurance – Live in New York City
    9. Brian Free & Assurance – Lovin’ This Livin’ for the Lord
    10. The Perrys – Look No Further

  30. Top Ten:

    1. Gold City – Preparing The Way
    2. Cathedrals – Travelin’ Live
    3. Gold City – Windows Of Home
    4. Imperials – Imperials (early 70s)
    5. Greater Vision – 20 Inspirational Favorites
    6. Gold City – Walk The Talk
    7. Gold City – What A Great Lifestyle
    8. Singing Americans – Black & White
    9. Imperials – Live (1973)
    10. Brian Free & Assurance – Things That Last Forever

    Honorable Mentions:

    * Gold City – Pillars Of Faith
    * Gold City – A 10 Year Celebration
    * Gold City – Classics
    * Gold City – Signed, Sealed, Delivered
    * Greater Vision – The King Came Down
    * Singing Americans – Live & Alive
    * Cathedrals – Master Builder
    * Kingsmen – Big & Live
    * Booth Brothers – This Stage Of Grace
    * Palmetto State Quartet – There’s Something Going On

    Future considerations that I think are too recent to move higher:

    * Gold City – Revival
    * Perrys – Look No Further
    * Crossway – This I Know

  31. Oh What a Saviour sung by Curtis Elkins on
    Down Thru The Years CD
    Never a greater tenor than Curtis Elkins.

  32. Does anyone know how to obtain the albumn that has Curtis Elkins singing Oh What A Savior? It is my all time favorite song. I gave it to my brother for his radio show in the 90’s and it’s been lost. I’d really like to find another copy.

  33. I have a copy but have no idea how you could get one. I ordered mine along with a couple of others from Curtis Elkins online a few years ago. But I didn’t keep his address.
    If you go to Texas Gospel Music Hall of Fame, there you can email Curtis or someone who knows him.
    Hope you find him.

  34. Hey all. The main reason i stumbled on to this site, is because I’ve been searching for the Singing Americans Black & White album. Actually, ive been wanting to find somewhere, or someone who may have knowledge to point me in the right direction to find it. I’d be happy to find a site that i can hear that particular album. I saw them perform that album at a HUGE outdoor SG music convention in 1986 in Pa. I was 15 at the time, but i remember it very well. I met all the Kingsmen, Kingsboys, & Singing Americans, & was VERY impressed with Michael English’s voice. there were many others there too, but those guys really made an impact on me. ….ok, enough rambling 🙂 …If anyone can help me, Id love ya forever. Thanks in advance, & may the Lord Bless.

  35. Tommy, the complete album wouldn’t be available for free playing on any legal website. However, if you’re interested in purchasing a copy, you might search on Amazon.com and eBay.com. The album pops up periodically on both sites.

  36. Guys, my list is short & sweet, because I’m only gonna list one project. My reason for this is because in my opinion the greatest Southern Gospel album of all times, by any artist, is “Live & Alive” by The Singing Americans.

  37. Tommy, If you haven’t found the “Black & White” album as of yet, e-mail me at rogtn@yahoo.com & I’ll e-mail you a copy of it! :>)

    • Just so long as it’s not a pirated copy, that’s OK. 🙂

  38. Lynn, (comment #34) I have that album With Curtis Elkins!

  39. I owned an album by the Gospel Echoes; it is Buck and Dottie Rambo singing without Reba but with a young lady.
    My brother who had no business doing this gave my album away many years ago.. How dare he?
    What was he thinking?

    I emailed Dottie Rambo and Larry Ferguson emailed me back saying that Dottie Rambo said she did not have it, that I would have to go through Benson Music. However she did send me free of charge the Lost Recordings of the Rambos. That was sweet of her.

    I did try Benson Music without success. I looked all over the Internet, but no Cross Country Concert album by the Gospel Echoes is anywhere in sight.
    Anyone out there know of this music?

    I would love it on CD.

    • Barbara, I do have an mp3 album called “March Around The Throne” by The Gospel Echoes. The year of release is unknown.
      This the songlist:

      01 In The Valley
      02 The Holy Hills
      03 Thank You For The Valley
      04 Easterling Rambo Medley
      05 March Around The Throne
      06 I Should Have Been Crucified
      07 I Won’t Have To Worry
      08 By And By The Night Will Vanish
      09 We’re Not Home Yet, Children
      10 Ten Thousand Years

      I don’t have the picture cover.

      My e-mail: jeffjimayars@hotmail.com

  40. Roger Peters – please let me know how to obtain a copy of the record you have of Curtis Elkins singing Oh What A Savior. I just now saw your post to my May 08 question.

  41. Still trying to find Curtis Elkins singing Oh What A Savior Does anyone know how I can get it?

    • You can contact Curtis through the Texas Gospel Music Hall Of Fame, he has been inducted there and they have information that will lead you to him.
      Information is here on this page.

    • Curtis lives in Fort Worth and attends First Baptist Church. I suspect they could help you there.

  42. Since Wes Burke is doing a “Top 5” poll over on his blog, I thought it would be appropriate to revisit this thread, which isn’t as formal of course but is similar in topic.

    As a “new” SG fan, I’m not in a position yet to get a really good Top Ten together, but as of now the Cathedrals’ Deep In the Heart of Texas would have to be somewhere near the top!

    • I would absolutely agree with you there. Just listened to that one earlier this week for the first time in over a year, and I had forgotten how good it is.

  43. Here goes, off the top of my head:

    1. Cathedrals, Symphony of Praise
    2. Gold City, Signed Sealed Delivered
    3. Gold City, Are You Ready
    4. Mark Trammell Trio, Always Have a Song
    5. Gold City, What a Great Lifestyle
    6. Cathedrals, Travelin’ Live
    7. Greater Vision, It’s Just Like Heaven
    8. Mark Trammell Trio, Once Upon a Cross
    9. Kingdom Heirs, Forever Changed
    10. Gold City, Pressed Down Shaken Together Running Over
    11. Gold City, Preparing the Way
    12. Cathedrals, Master Builder
    13. Greater Vision, 20 Inspirational Favorites
    14. Kingdom Heirs, True to the Call
    15. Kingsmen, Mississippi Live

    OK, I have to stop there. Did you notice that one person is on 12 of those 15 albums? 🙂

    • I forgot Gold City’s Within the Rock…that would probably be between Travelin’ Live and It’s Just Like Heaven.

      1996-2001 Gold City is my musical heaven…but I still call the Cathedrals my favorite group overall.

      • Another album I would put on my Top Ten would be the Cats’ High and Lifted Up, which I’m surprised nobody else has mentioned yet.


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